2023 Canadian Armed Forces General and Flag Officer senior promotions and appointments

[Haggis]

Maybe she doesn’t hate herself enough to do it? She’s got almost 41 years in and may simply be looking forward to retirement.

Maybe she saw what happened to the first female RCMP Commissioner and wants none of that.

 

[captloadie]

She has already made the decision to retire, and had announced it to her staff. There is even a date set for her DWD in August. While some of the GO/FOs know where they are penciled in to go this APS, much is dependent on the cascading effect of who ends up as the CDS and what vacancies that opens up down the line, in addition to the retirements. If the Vice-Admiral is passed over, does he also decide to retire and further cause posting churn?

 

[KevinB]

I was thinking to say I thought that was the plan

Better to drop the CDS to a 3* given the actual size of the CAF, and truncate the rest of the GO/FO "Fleet".

 

[OldSolduer]

Maybe she saw what happened to the first female RCMP Commissioner and wants none of that.

Perhaps but IMO she was cursed from the word go thanks to a feminist PM

 

[MJP]

Better to drop the CDS to a 3* given the actual size of the CAF, and truncate the rest of the GO/FO "Fleet".

Meh, we live in all pigs are equal world. While I detest some aspects of our GOFO bloat, not really heartbroken that our CDS is 4*.

SJS can play a strong(er) role than they currently do. The nature of the game means that they need to be equal to do so. I might hate the game, but I defo didn't hate the player.

 

[MilEME09]

Better to drop the CDS to a 3* given the actual size of the CAF, and truncate the rest of the GO/FO "Fleet".

Given the actual size of the Canadian Army, the CDS could be a Major General (since a division is usually up to 25k, times each branch being a division to create a corp called the CAF) and it would make sense. Then just carry it all down the line.

 

[KevinB]

Meh, we live in all pigs are equal world. While I detest some aspects of our GOFO bloat, not really heartbroken that our CDS is 4*.

SJS can play a strong(er) role than they currently do. The nature of the game means that they need to be equal to do so. I might hate the game, but I defo didn't hate the player.

I understand that issue. However when one looks at the CAF as a whole, and how the salaries devour its budget, pruning some of those leafs would not be a bad thing.

 

[dimsum]

Given the actual size of the Canadian Army, the CDS could be a Major General (since a division is usually up to 25k, times each branch being a division to create a corp called the CAF) and it would make sense. Then just carry it all down the line.

While I don’t think it’s a bad idea to cut budgets, my question would be how that looks in international defence relations.

Norway (active duty 23000, 20000 reserves, 40000 Home Guard bc of conscription) has a 4* General. Australia (50,000 active duty, 32000 reserves) has a 4* General.

We can say “well we don’t have the people to warrant a 4*” and that might be true, but optics and rank equivalency are things. Ask anyone who was an SME as a lower rank than the rest of the international folks, especially if said SME is an NCM in a meeting full of senior officers.

We in the CAF may think that we treat junior ranks (as in junior to us, not Pte-MCpls) harshly, but compared to other (even allied) militaries, we’re pretty egalitarian as far as the spectrum goes.

 

[KevinB]

While I don’t think it’s a bad idea to cut budgets, my question would be how that looks in international defence relations.

Norway (active duty 23000, 20000 reserves, 40000 Home Guard bc of conscription) has a 4* General. Australia (50,000 active duty, 32000 reserves) has a 4* General.

We can say “well we don’t have the people to warrant a 4*” and that might be true, but optics and rank equivalency are things. Ask anyone who was an SME as a lower rank than the rest of the international folks, especially if said SME is an NCM in a meeting full of senior officers.

We in the CAF may think that we treat junior ranks (as in junior to us, not Pte-MCpls) harshly, but compared to other (even allied) militaries, we’re pretty egalitarian as far as the spectrum goes.

WSE folks for external positions.

 

[Furniture]

Ask anyone who was an SME as a lower rank than the rest of the international folks

FTFY...

 

[dimsum]

WSE folks for external positions.

Sure, but most GOFOs interact with external folks at some point or another. If we WSE all of them, we end up with the same issue.

As an aside, our staff hangers-on are generally a rank or two below the equivalent (i.e. GOFO of the same rank) for our FVEY allies, and with smaller teams in general.

 

[KevinB]

Sure, but most GOFOs interact with external folks at some point or another. If we WSE all of them, we end up with the same issue.

As an aside, our staff hangers-on are generally a rank or two below the equivalent (i.e. GOFO of the same rank) for our FVEY allies, and with smaller teams in general.

If three Canadian Officers get together, they immediately form an HQ…

 

[Blackadder1916]

Better to drop the CDS to a 3* given the actual size of the CAF, and truncate the rest of the GO/FO "Fleet".

While that may give the appearance of reducing costs, remember that the salaries of GOFOs (and Cols) are tied to the remuneration of PS senior executives and their level is determined by the position they hold. Even if the CDS was a 3*, he would still be paid comparable to a DM and so on and so on down the line.

 

[KevinB]

While that may give the appearance of reducing costs, remember that the salaries of GOFOs (and Cols) are tied to the remuneration of PS senior executives and their level is determined by the position they hold. Even if the CDS was a 3*, he would still be paid comparable to a DM and so on and so on down the line.

So you need to chop PS salaries too then…

The idea that .gov personnel should make the same as private industry when they get better benefits and job security is ridiculous.

 

[McG]

So you need to chop PS salaries too then…

The idea that .gov personnel should make the same as private industry when they get better benefits and job security is ridiculous.

The idea that someone should not be entitled to what they get because it’s not what I get is a little narrow. Why should public servants get less because private industry has eroded benefits to employees? Why shouldn’t the employee of private industry get more when their employers and senior executives are seeing record profit?

 

[dapaterson]

While that may give the appearance of reducing costs, remember that the salaries of GOFOs (and Cols) are tied to the remuneration of PS senior executives and their level is determined by the position they hold. Even if the CDS was a 3*, he would still be paid comparable to a DM and so on and so on down the line.

Yes. But...

If you review the GiC announcements, you'll see that the CDS has been tied to different levels of compensation over the years. The current CDS is now in the same pay range as the current DM, but that is a relatively recent thing.

Down ranking the top position puts downward pressure on their subordinates and may ultimately save money.

 

[Gunplumber]

While that may give the appearance of reducing costs, remember that the salaries of GOFOs (and Cols) are tied to the remuneration of PS senior executives and their level is determined by the position they hold. Even if the CDS was a 3*, he would still be paid comparable to a DM and so on and so on down the line.

But if you reduce the CDS to a 3 star then you reduce the number of GOFOs under him/her and that means you save money!

 

[Haggis]

So you need to chop PS salaries too then…

The idea that .gov personnel should make the same as private industry when they get better benefits and job security is ridiculous.

Not always.

My son works for a major international trucking fleet as a mechanic His benefits far outweigh what anyone in his job in the PS would get. He's treated very, very well.

 

[KevinB]

The idea that someone should not be entitled to what they get because it’s not what I get is a little narrow. Why should public servants get less because private industry has eroded benefits to employees? Why shouldn’t the employee of private industry get more when their employers and senior executives are seeing record profit?

Private Industry has never have a .gov type leave policy, nor the employment safeguards.

 

[KevinB]

Not always.

My son works for a major international trucking fleet as a mechanic His benefits far outweigh what anyone in his job in the PS would get. He's treated very, very well.

I’m speaking in generalities, however he doesn’t have any true job security other than his work ethic and skill…